This week we have comedy writers Arnie and Jay Kogen as well as comedy writing legend Alan Zweibel.

Opening

“Dean Martin Variety Show”: Dean Martin and John Wayne

The Simpsons: Homer Sells Soul for a Donut

Introduction

Ed talked about the John Wayne and Dean Martin clip from the intro, and noted that there’s a discrepancy between the kind of people the Friars used to roast (Hollywood bigshots) and who gets roasted now (Pam Anderson).

He then reminisced about childhood trips to the beach with his family. It typically involved his mother yelling at him to not swim too far out into the ocean. His uncle also owned a ride called The Rotor while would spin you around really fast, and then take you picture as you vomited.

Ed also recalled “Back to School” time when he was a kid, which involved going to the clothing store for husky mama’s boys.

Comedy News with Julie Mitchell

Robert Kelly at Off the Hook

Frank Caliendo is touring.

The latest from Brian Regan

Julie also suggests people go see Gary Gulman (from “Last Comic Standing” a few seasons back)

Julie Mitchell is back at Ye Old King’s Head on Thursday night! She gave Ed’s viewers a special sneak peek at her act. She killed.

Interview with The Kogens

“Carol Burnett Show”: Went With the Wind

- Tell us about working on “Carol Burnett.” Why was it okay for them to crack up while they’re on TV? How was the writer’s room run?

ARNIE: It was an easy, fun show to write. There won’t a lot of notes. Working with pros like Tim Conway and Harvey Korman made it even easier.

- You’ve said people get into entertainment to get love, and it’s actually the worst place for that.

JAY: It’s just a nonstop cavalcade of rejection. Smart people don’t put pictures up on their walls, because they know it won’t last.

- Jay, tell us about when you got the job on “The Simpsons”?

JAY: His dad didn’t know what “The Simpsons” was, but Jay explained it was a cartoon. Arnie thought that was a crazy step down from working on live-action TV to work on a cartoon. There weren’t any cartoons on TV at that point.

ARNIE: He wanted Jay to be an agent, but Jay was always a funny kid.

JAY: He used to do jokes just for his Dad’s benefit.

They used to do a bit together where they would put whipped cream on their faces.

- Was it like “Dick van Dyke,” having a father-son team of comedy writers?

ARNIE: Alan Zweibel had a bit of that experience, but not the Kogens. Dean Martin never even learned Arnie’s name, and used to call him “Marty.” Dean once recognized Arnie’s wife at a restaurant and not Arnie.

- Talk about working on live TV?

ARNIE: Live shows didn’t used to be a huge problem. One live award show he worked on had an issue. Perry Como was hosting but one of the guests wanted to be the host instead. The guest eventually sabotaged the show by speaking abnormally slowly.

-Talk about the beginnings of “The Simpsons”

JAY: Producer James L Brooks worked out a deal with Fox. 13 episodes but no network notes. Because Fox was so desperate for talent, they went for it.

The writers still got notes from the producers, but no network notes. Jay thinks sometimes network notes are actually kind of helpful, and sometimes they’re neutral, but there are times the notes are truly harmful. But it’s the same with notes from other comedy writers.

Discussion with the Kogens and Alan Zweibel via Skype

- Were the censors hard on SNL in the early days?

ALAN: Stuff that seems tame now, they had to fight for back then.

For example, in “Weekend Update” (which Alan produced), Gilda Radner played a character named Emily Litella, who would rant about news stories she had misheard. It was a popular character at first. Anyway, one time, she did the bit with the phrase “endangered feces” (instead of “endangered species.”) So “Update” host Jane Curtin told her off during the segment’s dress rehearsal, and Litella called her a “bitch” under her breath.

In 1975, this was a big deal, and the censors said “you can’t say bitch on television.” Alan argued that the word “bitch” was being used as an adverb – she was saying that Jane was “bitching,” not using the word as a noun, which would be offensive. The censor bought the argument.

Emily Litella on Puerto Rico

JAY: “The Simpsons” would have censor notes, but sometimes they’d ask them to make things dirtier.

- Talk a bit about writing variety shows, particularly during the drug-fueled ’70s.

ARNIE: The big issue would be, you’d have people starring on variety shows who weren’t funny. For example, you’d have Lorne Greene, who is not funny, starring in all of the night’s sketches.

Also, Arnie once had a situation where he had an unhappy Charo on his hands.

The first episode of every variety show, someone would think they could get Cary Grant to be on the show. Eventually, they’d settle for whomever they could get.

- Alan, you started in the Catskills, as did Arnie. Tell us about that.

ALAN: He got to the Catskills in the early ’70s. He started by working for a guy named Morty Gunty, who they’d seen open for Engelbert Humperdinck. He was paid $7 per joke. Arnie started working for him, too.

ARNIE: One joke he wrote for Morty Gunty:

“The other night, I was reading ‘The Joy of Sex,’ my wife was reading ‘The Joy of Cooking.’ Together, we brought a brisket to climax.” Alan took that joke and changed it to “pot roast.” Pot roast was a hipper meat at the time.

Alan had made a book of his jokes to give to Lorne Michaels. He had 1100 jokes in the book. The first joke:

“The postal service is issuing a new stamp honoring prostitution. It’s a 10-cent stamp, but if you lick it, it’s a quarter.”

According to Seth Meyers, who heard about it from Lorne Michaels, that joke got Alan the job on “SNL.”

Alan grew up reading Kogen’s stuff in “MAD Magazine.” When he got to the Catskills, he considered Arnie his idol.

- Jay won an Emmy for “Frasier”…It also won a Humanitas Prize. What was it like to be on stage and win the awards?

They were two different episodes for which he won. He doesn’t place a high value on awards, partly because his Dad had always had them. The advantage of winning is that you get to make a speech and make a joke.

When he won, he had a whole page of jokes prepared. He had planned to imitate Roberto Benigni and hug celebrities he didn’t know. He also said “thanks for giving a rich, well-connected white guy a chance.” They cut him off for the West Coast feed.

He also brought his previous Emmys from other years that he had won to the event so people would treat him with more respect.

- Alan, talk about collaborating with people like Billy Crystal and Garry Shandling.

ALAN: It depends on the person. His first collaborator was Gilda Radner and they made each other laugh, so they just followed their instincts. He and Shandling hooked up because of Bernie Brillstein and Brad Gray, their managers.

The first time he spoke to Shandling, Garry told him “my dog’s penis tastes funny.” He also worked with Martin Short on his Broadway show.

Martin Short: “Fame Becomes Me”

You need to be able to adapt to work with each individual comedian’s voice and personality. You give yourself up a little bit.

- Is there a character or a sketch you’re most proud of?

ARNIE: One called “The Pail” from “Carol Burnett,” with her and Harvey Korman.

“Carol Burnett Show”: The Pail

The dress rehearsal was better than the version that they did for the air. Carol Burnett was brilliant and there was also nothing Harvey Korman couldn’t do.

- All the guests were at Jay’s bachelor party at the Friar’s Club, and it featured the last performance from comedian Pat McCormack. He was one of the head writers for Johnny Carson.

ARNIE: Some of his favorite Pat McCormack lines:

“Have the Three Stooges ever turned down a script?”
“I met the cruelest man in the world. He gave a Polaroid camera to a man with 9 seconds to live.”
“I passed by a Big and Tall Men’s Shop and saw a truck backing up delivering a shoe.”

- How did “It’s Garry Shandling Show” come about? What was the inspiration for breaking the 4th wall?

Jay was an actor and delivery boy on the show, Alan was a co-creator.

Alan had grown up watching “The Dick Van Dyke” show and wishing for that kind of life. So when he started writing comedy shows, he wanted to do a show about himself. Shandling had a similar idea, and both were enthusiastic about having the main character talking to the camera.

(The next-door neighbors were based on the Zweibels).

HBO had done “Dream On,” but needed more original shows. They lived on opposite coasts and sent their scripts back and forth via FedEx, who were faxing it back and forth. They were forced, by the format, to be more theatrical than most TV shows.

Alan and Garry thought of the theme song in an elevator. They wrote the entire song during one trip down to the lobby, just throwing out lines.

It’s Garry Shandling’s Show: Theme Song

- Let’s talk about working on “Fraiser”

JAY: He had to decide between working on “Seinfeld” and “Frasier.” He chose “Frasier” because he wanted to work on it to get something really classy on my resume.

Fraiser: “Father of the Bride”

The actors would work very hard on the show, and would sometimes improve and enhance the material. It was very collaborative between actors and writers.

Arnie pitched to Jay while he was supervising producer on “Frasier,” and none of his ideas were accepted.

- Alan told a story about debating between “Hollywood Squares” vs. “Saturday Night Live” for writing jobs.

He ended up deciding because he thought SNL sounded more fun. Everyone involved was young and fresh, and it sounded so weird, he just decided to do it.